Re: The last word on the 911 Pentagon matter

Inviato da  SirEdward il 7/9/2007 13:40:40
Ashoka, è stato Mineta stesso a dire di essere arrivato al momento dell'evacuazione.

E sappiamo per certo che Mineta non poteva (per motivi di tempo) essere al Pentagono con aa77 a 50 miglia.

Come li spieghi questi fatti?

E poi, Ashoka, Clarke afferma di aver parlato con Jane Garvey e di averle chiesto:

"Jane, where is Norm", I asked. They were frantically looking for Norman Mineta, the secretary of transportation [...]. At first FAA couldn't find him. "Well Jane, can you [ordere?] the aircraft down? We gonna have to clear the aerospace around Washington and New York."We may have to do a lot more than that, Dick" she said, "I already put a hold on all take-offs and landings in New York and Washingotn, but we've reports of 11 aircraft off-course or out of communication. Maybe Hijacked". [Lisa] slowly whispered: "oh shit..."."All conversations had stopped in the studios on the screens. Everyone was listening. "11?" I repeated. "Ok, Jane. How long will it take to get all aircraft now [???] onto the ground somewhere?" [...] "The air traffic manager" Jane went on "says there are 44 hundred birds up now. We can cancel all take-offs quickly. But grounding... All that are already up? Nobody's ever done that before. Don't know how long that will take". "Jane, if you haven't found the secretary yet, are you prepared to order a national ground stop and no fly zone?". "Yes" she said, "but it will take a while". Shortly thereafter, Mineta called in from his car.

"Jane, dov'è Norm" chiesi. Stavano freneticamente cercando Norman Mineta, il ministro dei trasporti [...] All'inizio la FAA non riusciva a trovarlo. "Beh, Jane, puoi ordinare a tutti gli aerei di atterrare? Dobbiamo svuotare lo spazio aereo attorno a Washington e New York."Potremmo dover fare molto di più, Dick" disse "Ho già fermato tutti i decolli e gli atterraggi a New York e a Washington, ma abbiamo notizie di 11 aerei fuori rotta o che hanno interrotto le comuniczioni. Forse dirottati. [Lisa] sussurrò lentamente "oh merda...". "Tutte le conversazioni erano cessate negli studi sugli schermi. Tutti ascoltavano. "11?" ripetei. "Ok, Jane. Quanto ci vorrà per portare a terra da qualche parte tutti gli aerei ora in volo?" [...] "Il traffic air manager dice che ci sono 4400 aerei in volo in questo momento. Possiamo annullare i decolli rapidamente [il blocco dei decolli è avvenuto alle 9:26 N.d.T.], Ma gli atterraggi... Tutti quelli che sono in volo? Nessunoha mai fatto una cosa simile prima d'ora. Non so quanto ci vorrà". "Jane, se non avete ancora trovato il ministro, sei pronta ad ordinare un blocco a tutti i voli e la no-fly zone? Sì, disse. Ma ci vorrà un po'. Poco dopo, Mineta chiamò dalla propria auto.

e anche:

Citazione:
(9:26 a.m.) September 11, 2001: Rookie FAA Manager Bans All Take Offs Nationwide, Including Most Military Flights? Mineta Asserts He Issues Order Minutes Later
Edit event

FAA Administrator Jane Garvey. FAA Administrator Jane Garvey. [Source: FAA]Time magazine later reports that Jane Garvey, head of the FAA, “almost certainly after getting an okay from the White House, initiate[s] a national ground stop, ------------------------------------------------------------------------------which forbids takeoffs and requires planes in the air to get down as soon as is reasonable.----------------------------------------------------------------- The order, which has never been implemented since flying was invented in 1903, applie[s] to virtually every single kind of machine that can takeoff—civilian, military, or law enforcement.” Military and law enforcement flights are allowed to resume at 10:31 a.m. (see 10:31 a.m. September 11, 2001) A limited number of military flights—the FAA will not reveal details—are allowed to fly during this ban. [Time, 9/14/2001] --------------------------------------------Garvey later calls it “a national ground stop…----------------------------------- that prevented any aircraft from taking off.” [US Congress, 9/21/2001] ---------------------------------------------Transportation Secretary Norman Mineta later says he was the one to give the order: “As soon as I was aware of the nature and scale of the attack, I called from the White House to order the air traffic system to land all aircraft, immediately and without exception.” [US Congress. Senate. Committee on Commerce, Science and Transportation, 9/20/2001] According to Mineta, “At approximately 9:45… I gave the FAA the final order for all civil aircraft to land at the nearest airport as soon as possible.”--------------------------------------------------- [9/11 Commission, 5/23/2003] At the time, 4,452 planes are flying in the continental US. --------------------------------------------------A later account states that Ben Sliney, the FAA’s National Operations Manager, makes the decision without consulting his superiors, like Jane Garvey, first.------------------------------------------------------ It would be remarkable if Sliney was the one to make the decision, because 9/11 is Sliney’s first day on the job as National Operations Manager, “the chess master of the air traffic system.” [USA Today, 8/13/2002] When he accepted the job a couple of months earlier, he had asked, “What is the limit of my authority?” The man who had promoted him replied, “Unlimited.” [USA Today, 8/13/2002] --------------------------------------Yet another account, by Linda Schuessler, manager of tactical operations at the FAA Command Center where Sliney was located, says, “… it was done collaboratively… ------------------------------------------------All these decisions were corporate decisions. It wasn’t one person who said, ‘Yes, this has got to get done.’” [Aviation Week and Space Technology, 12/17/2001] ----------------------------------About 500 planes land in the next 20 minutes, and then much more urgent orders to land are issued at 9:45 a.m. (see (9:45 a.m.) September 11, 2001)



e...

Citazione:
(9:45 a.m.) September 11, 2001: Senior FAA Manager, on His First Day on the Job, Orders All Planes Out of the Sky Nationwide
Edit event

--------------------------------------------------Ben Sliney, FAA’s National Operations Manager, orders the entire nationwide air traffic system shut down. All flights at US airports are stopped. Around 3,950 flights are still in the air. Sliney makes the decision without consulting FAA head Jane Garvey, Transportation Secretary Norman Mineta, or other bosses, but they quickly approve his actions.-------------------------------------------------------- It’s Sliney’s first day on the job. [CNN, 9/12/2001; New York Times, 9/12/2001; Washington Post, 9/12/2001; MSNBC, 9/22/2001; Associated Press, 8/12/2002; USA Today, 8/13/2002; USA Today, 8/13/2002; USA Today, 8/13/2002; Associated Press, 8/19/2002; Newsday, 9/10/2002] Seventy-five percent of the planes land within one hour of the order. [USA Today, 8/12/2002] The 9/11 Commission will later remark that this “was an unprecedented order” that the “air traffic control system handled… with great skill.” [9/11 Commission, 7/24/2004, pp. 29] The Washington Post has reported that Mineta told Monte Belger at the FAA: “Monte, bring all the planes down,” even adding, “[Expletive] pilot discretion.” [Washington Post, 1/27/2002] -------------------------------------------However, it is later reported by a different Post reporter that Mineta did not even know of the order until 15 minutes later. This reporter “says FAA officials had begged him to maintain the fiction.” [Slate, 4/2/2002]
-----------------------------------------

Ho evidenziato i punti salienti.
In soldoni: un primo ordine è stato dato dalla Garvey, alle 9:26. Il secondo, più pressante, da Ben Sliney, alle 9:45.
Sembra addirittura che Mineta non sapesse ancora nulla dell'ordine di atterraggio generalizzato addirittura un quarto d'ora dopo.
E infatti Belger non dice CHI ha dato l'ordine, dice solo che è arrivato.

Pare proprio che non sia stato Mineta a ordinare a tutti gli aerei di atterrare, alle 9:45.

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&startpos=2100

Messaggio orinale: https://old.luogocomune.net/site/newbb/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=3763&post_id=98983